CAL Team Fortress 2 League

[CHIPMAN]

So I'm running, officially named the CAL-TF2 General Manager earlier tonight, which means I'm in charge of pretty much everything TF2-related.

Not looking for praise or anything (though I'll gladly take it), just wanted to use this to get some feedback

What would you all like to see in a TF2 league? Base it on what you either have seen in current leagues already, or just any personal preferences. Biggest question I have is match size? Thoughts? 6v6? 8v8? etc...

There will be more news to come from me

Till then...

[POTOFGOLD]

8v8 seems to play nicely

[elwood-]

congrats chip. very good news

8v8 and also HIGHLANDER ftw.

[Mulchman MM]

No stupid class limits.

[PF.ankles?]

6v6

[beyond]

Haven't played 8v8, but 6v6 seems to play just fine to me.

[oPey]

both 8v8 and 6v6 are fun

[primer]

8v8 would be awesome. 6v6 is ok. but if you went 8v8 i would love to see cr_ng 2. everything else let it fly. too many ngs on some maps is crazy tho



either way, congrats! and i love seeing a tfc guy in a HUGE league

[Draxx]

Congrats, Chip.

While I don't mind 6v6, I can already see alot of class strategies on maps getting used over and over and it has become predictable to some extent. It would be interesting to introduce 8v8 into the mix and get alot of people used to 6v6 to re-think things and add some new classes to their lineup. With 6v6, there are already some classes that I don't see being utilized in favour of others.

Also, those two extra players per team means that 2 clanless players will have an opportunity to find a home perhaps or players who currently don't get to play as much will have an oppurtunity to.

I'd like to see very liberal class limits in the beginning stages of the league to give people a chance to be creative and experiment with completely off-the-wall type strategies until there's some sort of conensus as to what kind of class make-ups make the game unfun to play in a match situation.

[bravE]

6v6.

[StrongBad]

6v6 plz for the good of the game

[Loser]

Originally Posted by StrongBad

6v6 plz for the good of the game

i don't get this argument. there are 9 classes in the game; team fortress has historically been played 9v9. what does 6v6 bring to the table other than that's what CS/DoD players are used to?

[natedizzle]

the more I think about it, 8v8 when organized could turn into giant stalemates. a lot of the caps in 6v6 comes from organized rushes that kill the entire team and then they get some chain caps. just do 6v6 without so many extreme class limits, 1 demo and maybe 1 med is all thats needed imo.

[Minoxic]

Originally Posted by Jarek

the more I think about it, 8v8 when organized could turn into giant stalemates. a lot of the caps in 6v6 comes from organized rushes that kill the entire team and then they get some chain caps. just do 6v6 without so many extreme class limits, 1 demo and maybe 1 med is all thats needed imo.

ABLE played KHR 8v8 tuesday night and there wasn't even 1 stalemate. I doubt this was out of the norm either but we'll see

[bravE]

To Loser:

In my opinion 6v6 is the best format for competitive play. Have you played any scrims 6v6, or no ? If you haven't, explain how you've come onto the conclusion that 8v8 is better than 6v6. Just cuz TFC was 8v8 doesn't mean this game should be too, TWO COMPLETELY different games and styles of play.

[MightyMouse]

6v6 for maps like well, granary. I think other maps like gravelpit and dustbowl can and should support higher, however cal usually hes a set # vs #. Id suggest something for 2fort but I dont even want to play that map, let alone think about it.

Its a shame im banned from CAL

[sPloOsH]

congrats on admin status...

This question is being asked everywhere on all forums.

I agree 6v6 plays great. (people forget that in TFC it was 4v5 not 9v9).

dont play gravelpit at all in CAL.

dustbowl needs to be reworked with a timer

gl you will need it =) i've never seen so much instant controversy in a game before.....

[Loser]

Originally Posted by bravE

To Loser:

In my opinion 6v6 is the best format for competitive play.

you are certainly welcome to your opinion, but what is 6v6 based upon? have you ever played any scrims 8v8? if you haven't, explain how you've come to the conclusion that 6v6 is better than 8v8.

Have you played any scrims 6v6, or no ? If you haven't, explain how you've come onto the conclusion that 8v8 is better than 6v6. Just cuz TFC was 8v8 doesn't mean this game should be too, TWO COMPLETELY different games and styles of play.

the only scrim i've played in so far has been 9v9 highlander on well, which was a lot of fun. and TFC is played 9v9 'seriously' , although the 5v5 league format has been very popular as well. TFC was also played in leagues in a 2v2 format, 4v4 scrims are still pretty popular, and then of course there is the ADL league which is played 8v8.

the 9v9 idea comes from the fact that team fortress has traditionally had 9 different classes, and it was generally held that the defense needed an extra man, so you typically had 4 O going against 5 D for ctf matches. in the last couple of years or so, some maps that were deemed to be generally defensive in nature have been played 8v8 because 4 O couldn't cap against 5 D if the teams were roughly equal in abilities.

seriously, where does 6v6 come from?

[MightyMouse]

People enjoy playing as a clan or group outside of matches because they dont enjoy pubbing. So its a low number of 6 which still requires the teamwork and room to play. This is like in TFC where it was 4v4's becuase you could get 4 people together.

Besides, there was only 6 classes really used in TFC

6v6 came from DoD/CS Players

[GhOsT]

Originally Posted by MightyMouse

Besides, there was only 6 classes really used in TFC

That doesn't mean only 6 classes get used in TF2.

[MightyMouse]

really? seems like it so far. Im not saying 6v6 is the best, but thats the idea why people want 6v6 over 8v8

[GhOsT]

People want to 6v6 over 8v8 because it's easier to get 6 people for a match than 8 and they feel that 6v6 is faster paced than 8v8. Playing 6v6 forces you to use certain classes and other classes that might otherwise be useful get pushed aside.

[InnerFury]

6v6 on maps like well seems like its more suitable. granary is tough choice but id probably swing with 6v6 to avoid a huge battle at c.

any ctf maps have the chance to be good 8v8, and i see 6v6 a little lacking. lacking in strat and capability for smart play. The problem is turtling and chasing. since this game doesnt have extremely skillful ways to out play your opponent anyone could force a stalemate. This is where maybe a ovd rule would be nice but no one wants to be the first asshole to implement this. mainly because it shouldnt be so early in a game.

maybe its just the 2fort but i doubt it. I dont really see 3o vs 3d really exciting on any map, but the more people you add the more people to backtrack and chase you also add atm.

so if you did implement 8v8 you would inturn have to piss a lot of people off. including some of the ones wanting 8v8. staying 6v6 would probably be the smartest thing to do for starting off a league.

[CR0C0DILE]

wHAT i'D LIKE TO SEE IS cal SEPARATE FROM THE cpl.
iT'S HARD TO TAKE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE cpl SERIOUSLY.

[natedizzle]

Originally Posted by sPloOsH

I agree 6v6 plays great. (people forget that in TFC it was 4v5 not 9v9).

you do understand that the style of gameplay in TF2 resembles TFC's A/D (which in tfc is 8v8) and warpath (which has been played 10v10)

[|RES|arod]

Some maps require 8 players. Well and granary are about the only playable maps 6v6. 8 to a team is still more fun than 6 because you can use more diverse strategies. Also, the only class limits I can see are for the medic.

[Yukfo0]

7v7 ..serious its like 8v8+6v6

[bravE]

"People want to 6v6 over 8v8 because it's easier to get 6 people for a match than 8 and they feel that 6v6 is faster paced than 8v8."

qft, it is alot easier getting 5 others to play with all the time which makes scrims an any time possibility, which is awesome.

[Cobalt]

you suck chip

[Repair Man]

Originally Posted by |RES|arod

Also, the only class limits I can see are for the medic.

I'd add engineer to that as well...depending on the map, 2 or 3 guns with engis clanging away at certain positions just completely lock everything down.

I've seen a lot of people include HW into their list of classes that should be limited, but I think that is unnecessary. If the HW doesn't have a medic on him at all times, he quickly becomes one of the weakest classes in the entire game. Limiting the # of medics would therefore limit the # of HW's as well.

EDIT: For number of players, I kind of like the idea of varying the numbers based on the map. Like others have said, 6vs6 on well/granary works just fine, but isn't so hot on maps like gravelpit/dustbowl. It would make the game a lot more diverse.

EDIT2: Someone seriously needs to remake Scrummage, Run, Pipezone, and CZ/CZ2 for TF2. Right the fuck now.